Solved: I don't read good when people spell bad.

[moa]

Advice seems to be the most commonly misspelled word in this forum. I always see people signing off with "Thanks for the advise".

Okay not always...

[Bob Phillips]

Not as bad as misspelling misspelt.

[moa]

:yes Yes..

ov coarse misspelled iz an correctly spelted word. There's two correct spellings.

[Bob Phillips]

No, there may be an Americanised monstrosity, but there is one correct spelling.

I spell the word
I spelt the word
I misspell the word
I misspellt the word

[lucas]

Americanized sounds a lot like bas****ized when used that way....yep we're guilty. Didn't you have a rant in the forum about using nouns as verbs???

[moa]

I believe you are correct: it is an americanised version.:(

Oh the shame.

[mdmackillop]

I misspellt the word Personally, I would use "misspelled", if I ever misspellt anything! (as opposed to a typo.)

[TrippyTom]

I don't read good when people spell bad.

That is intentional poor grammar, correct? If you want to get nitpicky, I think that would be: "I don't read well when people spell badly." (poorly works well in this case too).

Disclaimer: I blame my evil 7th grade English teacher for this post. Actually I like to blame her for lots of things.

[Bob Phillips]

Americanized sounds a lot like bas****ized when used that way....yep we're guilty. Didn't you have a rant in the forum about using nouns as verbs???

Maybe I did, but that is irrelevant. It is used as an adjective in this context, monstrosity is the noun.

[Aussiebear]

I prefer not to use the word "misspelt", so I use "Stuffed it up again"

[moa]

That is intentional poor grammar, correct? If you want to get nitpicky, I think that would be: "I don't read well when people spell badly." (poorly works well in this case too).

Actually I didn't mean to pick nits.I just found it kind of funny that people stuff up (thank you Aussiebear) the word advice in a forum that gives advice. And I was bored.

Also I meant smell not spell. I find it hard to concentrate in my office due to the lack of personal hygiene amongst my colleagues.

[Aussiebear]

Hey Glen, I work in a 25000 head cattle feedlot with an associated abattior which has an annual 28000 kill rate just 400 meters away. Want to compare smells?

[Zack Barresse]

I used to work in the wastewater field. I'll compare smells. :devil2:

[Aussiebear]

Smell 1. Once a year re surface the pen floors. The "smell" is awful. Even the flies take a three day holiday until it tones down.

Smell 2. Every day we have to drive past the render works at the abattoir. Employees working in here are "unloved" (even by their mothers).

Smell 3. Liquid waste from the corn silage pits. This stuff is the binford 6400 version of super glue. You may have only accidentally stepped in a puddle but the smell seems to be ingrained ito the very pores of your skin. Nothing seems to dilute the odour. You may as well cancel your social life for the next month. Fellow employees avoid you like the plague. Even your supervisors will text you work requests rather than tell you face to face.

Aussie (Smelly) bear

[mdmackillop]

Hi Ted,
Having checked Wikipedia, it sounds as though it's just as well that each olfactory-challenged Aussie has a personal space of 375,000 square metres (or 92 acres)

[Brandtrock]

I misspell color and favor because I got me an American edumacation. :rofl:

[mdmackillop]

I recently came across this example of a noun being used as a verb.

That errored on me, this didn't.
Just shows how insidious this Americanisation has become. :devil2:

[Bob Phillips]

This is very odd, It is now 11:13 AM as I write this, Malcolm's post is timed at today at 11:10 AM, but Ted's is today at 11:40 AM? And in the forum page, Malcolm is showing as the latest poster. What is going on?

[Bob Phillips]

That's interesting Malcolm... I'll be right back. Just going over to the neighbours to tell them to pack up and give me back my 91 acres.

OK, explain this?

[mdmackillop]

Peculiar, I just reposted (and deleted) because I didn't see my post with Ted's retaining the last position.
I wonder where this will appear. Should be Post #20

[mdmackillop]

OK, explain this?
Re Top/Bottom posting, I think you need a new definition if you're going to quote a message 23 minutes before it appears.

[Aussiebear]

That's interesting Malcolm... I'll be right back. Just going over to the neighbours to tell them to pack up and give me back my 91 acres.

[mdmackillop]

I prefer not to use the word "misspelt", so I use "Stuffed it up again"


uh oh... vba begginer on the loose

Stuffed it up again? :whistle:

[geekgirlau]

No, there may be an Americanised monstrosity, but there is one correct spelling.

Why do we assume that English English is correct, whilst all other English-speaking nations are wrong? Why should I, in a completely different country, complete with it's own history, culture (okay, I'm Australian, so I might be pushing it with this one!), social mores and customs, not allow my language to develop and change over time in it's own unique way?

IMHO what would be wrong is blindly following the language of a country that we left more than 200 years ago.

[mdmackillop]

Adopting some of the language of the original inhabitants of your country seems fair and reasonable. Corrupting for no good reason, of a perfectly good language which developed over centuries, just seems the result of carelessness, rather than any deliberate attempt at improvement.:beerchug:

[geekgirlau]

The point is we didn't adopt it - it was our language. And in the same way that English has "developed over centuries", so has Australian English (and US English and any other you care to mention).

Corruption is in the eye of the beholder :creator:

[mdmackillop]

Corruption is in the eye of the beholder
Quite right. I know it when I see it.

[Bob Phillips]

By your logic, within a few years, English will be the universal world language, but each country's will be so different, we'll not understand each other anymore than we do foreign languages today.

[mdmackillop]

TIGER'S FAIR SCUNNERED (http://uk.wrs.yahoo.com/_ylt=A9htfMRAd8ZFR10BjhxQBQx.;_ylu=X3oDMTBjMHZkMjZyBHBvcwMxBHNlYwNzcg--/SIG=14vuh5v8g/EXP=1170720960/**http%3a//www.dailyrecord.co.uk/sport/golf/tm_headline=tiger-s-fair-scunnered-%26method=full%26objectid=18570883%26siteid=66633-name_page.html) http://us.i1.yimg.com/us.yimg.com/i/us/sch/bn/nw2.gif (http://uk.wrs.yahoo.com/_ylt=A9htfMRAd8ZFR10BjxxQBQx.;_ylu=X3oDMTBjMHZkMjZyBHBvcwMxBHNlYwNzcg--/SIG=14vuh5v8g/EXP=1170720960/**http%3a//www.dailyrecord.co.uk/sport/golf/tm_headline=tiger-s-fair-scunnered-%26method=full%26objectid=18570883%26siteid=66633-name_page.html) Daily Record - 03 Feb 05:01PM
GOLF god Tiger Woods admits Scots have got him beat. He doesn't understand a word we say. The American swears he would ; rather hear English served up by a Spaniard than strain his ears trying to fathom out the sayings of Sam Torrance.

[Bob Phillips]

He's not the only one in many cases :). Worst is Glasgow, I find Edinburgh and north much easier to understand.

[geekgirlau]

Actually I'd argue that the majority of time we don't understand each other period, no matter what the language.

[johnske]

Accents are different...

I remember when I was about 15 I went to a US warships' 'open day' in Sydney to look it over and this guy (I think he was from the Bronx - whatever that is) was talking to me and I couldn't understand one single word that he was saying, and he couldn't understand me, so this other US sailor who spoke American English that was passable as 'standard' English ended up translating for both of us... :rofl:

[Brandtrock]

So where would Middle English and Olde English fit in?

Bill (William Shakespeare) and Geoff (Geoffrey Chaucer) might find Modern English to be a wee bit of a bastardization of their beloved tongue, might they not?

Isn't it common for a language to morph over time as the "locals" use the language in a new geographical area? Canadian French varies from French French and Mexican Spanish varies from Spanish Spanish, although I'm unsure if the level is more or less than English English and US English vary.

Perhaps the problem is the northern half of the American continent (trying to defer to Bob's educational upbringing that recognizes six continents) just messes up everyone else's perfectly good language once it crosses the ocean.

To test my theory, does anyone know if the oriental languages spoken in Canada, the United States, and Mexico are as dissimilar to their home countymen as the European languages appear to be?

Maybe we can all just use Latin.

Just curious,

[Aussiebear]

Stuffed it up again? :whistle:

No way sport... I'm laying claim to it before the American's grab it.

[Aussiebear]

This is very odd, It is now 11:13 AM as I write this, Malcolm's post is timed at today at 11:10 AM, but Ted's is today at 11:40 AM? And in the forum page, Malcolm is showing as the latest poster. What is going on?

It the result of the spin of the earth. I'm 10 hours ahead of MD, and if you take into account that fact that i'm (slow), well I've lost 9.5 hours


That's my theory and I'm drinking to it.

[Bob Phillips]

Bill (William Shakespeare) and Geoff (Geoffrey Chaucer) might find Modern English to be a wee bit of a bastardization of their beloved tongue, might they not?
I very much doubt it. When they were working there were no language 'rules' of any form, no dictionaries, very little evidence of their written word. Oft times they would invent words because there was no word to describe what they were trying to say, and they would spell things differently over time as they didn't know/remember how it was spelt. We have benefits of technology, and I would venture that it is only a fool that would argue that the stregnth and beauty of Shakespeare lies in the way he spelt words, the beauty is in the rhyme, the poetry, the sheer imagination with the constructs of sentences.


Isn't it common for a language to morph over time as the "locals" use the language in a new geographical area?
Of course it is, and so it should, not just geographically, but socially, environmentally, politically, etc. etc.

But what is not necessary is to invent lazy constructs where a perfectly good word or phrase already exists (misspelled is a perfect example of this IMO). The language needs to evolve, it needs to grow, and contrary to what may be thought of my response to Ann, I welcome regional differences (the loss of dialects is a sad loss IMO). I love the fact that Americans use sidewalk, whereas we use pavement, that is language growth IMO, whereas misspelled and the use of momentarily is language bastardization (to quote your phrase), that is neither necessary, nor helpful to the use of the language. Don't forget, in many ways, we in England have evolved the language since we first setup the colonies, whereas they have maintained the older forms (who uses fall in England anymore?).

[Bob Phillips]

It the result of the spin of the earth. I'm 10 hours ahead of MD, and if you take into account that fact that i'm (slow), well I've lost 9.5 hours.

If that were so, we would answer all of your questions before you asked them.

[moa]

Found this the other day...


There are different stories for different groups of words.

The standardization of English spelling was a long, slow process, extending over centuries and full of hiccups and reversals.

For the words like ?center,? both the ?center? and ?centre? spellings were widely used in the Middle Ages. By the 16th century, however, the spelling ?center? had largely won out in Britain. This is the spelling preferred by Shakespeare, Milton, and other writers of the 16th and 17th centuries, and it is the spelling preferred in most dictionaries of the period. Naturally, therefore, ?center? was the spelling carried to the American colonies in the 17th century.

In the US, therefore, nothing much has happened. The prevalent spelling ?center? was endorsed by Noah Webster?s famous and influential American dictionary in 1828, and it has never since been threatened.

In Britain, however, the French-style spelling ?centre? made a comeback in the 18th century. This was preferred by several lexicographers, including the enormously influential Dr. Johnson in his 1755 dictionary, and, as a result, ?centre? displaced ?center? as the British spelling.

Something similar happens with the ?-ize? / ?-ise? words, like ?civilize? / ?civilise.? In this case, though, the etymological spelling is that with ?-ize? (which derives from the Greek suffix <-izein>), and the ?-ize? spelling was universal in English until around the 18th century. But then British writers noticed that the French had changed the spelling of their cognate suffix from <-izer> to <-iser>. The British began aping the French, and writing ?-ise? instead of ?-ize.? This new spelling was endorsed by Dr. Johnson, and it has since become very widespread in Britain. But not universal: some conservative quarters in Britain still insist on ?-ize.? An example is the august Oxford University Press, which still prefers ?-ize.? If you look up the suffix in the second edition of the Oxford English Dictionary, you will find a firm little lecture on the foolishness of writing ?-ise.?

In the US, none of this ever happened, and Americans continue to use the traditional ?-ize.?

But the ?color? words are different. Though the spelling had earlier fluctuated, ?colour? was pretty much established as the usual spelling in Britain by the 14th century, though ?color? continued to be used occasionally, under the influence of the Latin <color>, the ultimate (but not direct) source of the word.

But in 1828 Noah Webster opted for ?color.? He did this, apparently, partly because he preferred simpler spellings, and partly because he was eager to distinguish American English from British English. In fact, his dictionary contains a number of novel spellings for these reasons, but many of his proposals never caught on. However, Americans took a liking to his ?color,? and have made it their invariable spelling.

So, the chief reasons for the differences are the varying preferences of influential lexicographers, plus a substantial French influence on British English but not on American English.

[moa]

Hey Glen, I work in a 25000 head cattle feedlot with an associated abattior which has an annual 28000 kill rate just 400 meters away. Want to compare smells?

:think:

Aside from the BO, some women wear a lot of perfume at my work and when two or more of them are in the same room I have to hold a hanky to my nose.


He shoots, he scores...

...okay, you win.

[Bob Phillips]

Found this the other day...
Which, I think, is a more eloquent way of voicing what I said in #36. Whilst in England, the language has continued to evolve, in the US it has changed much less, presumably because they have not been open to the same influences.

I have no issue with the way Americans spell colour, or many other words. I prefer the spelling of colour myself, I feel it has an elegance by the addition of the u (m aybe my Francophile leanings?), but it is not an issue. What is an issue is people telling me that I misspelt colour, or having to use color in VBAX KB entries.

[moa]

Whilst in England, the language has continued to evolve, in the US it has changed much less, presumably because they have not been open to the same influences.

Indeed. Isolation has had something to do with it. They tend to dislike the French as well. A friend from Texas calls french people "cheese eating surrender monkeys".

[lucas]

What is an issue is people telling me that I misspelt colour, or having to use color in VBAX KB entries.
Sad that you think this is an issue in today's world.....I agree with Anne.
Actually I'd argue that the majority of time we don't understand each other period, no matter what the language.

[moa]

:wine:... to go with the cheese.

[Bob Phillips]

Sad that you think this is an issue in today's world.....I agree with Anne.

Maybe not a big one Steve, but still one for me, one that has removed any motivation that I may have had to write KB entries, as you know.

Unfortunately, there is very little I can do about the big ones, save waiting for us to make the planet uninhabitable, either by our determination to rape the planet, or by jingoistic, wrong-headed foreign policies provoking war :(

[Bob Phillips]

A friend from Texas calls french people "cheese eating surrender monkeys".

I know a few Brits who call them that as well :dunno.

[lucas]

Unfortunately, there is very little I can do about the big ones, save waiting for us to make the planet uninhabitable, either by our determination to rape the planet, or by jingoistic, wrong-headed foreign policies provoking war :(
True enough Bob. It sometimes seems that the feelings of helplessness about the big things contribute to our intolerance with each other on many levels...

One of the main draws of this forum for me has been the general effort by most to rise above the cultural and language diffences and work together to try to solve problems.

[Zack Barresse]

I think you're whining about the color/colour issue personally. No offense intended (I think you know that), just MHO. I don't think it should be an issue.

[Bob Phillips]

It isn't an issue, because I decline to be subjected to a policy that I must use American spellings and American date formats, which goes against things that I hold as important, when I am giving something freely that would take me time and effort to produce. OK, so I don't go up the rankings (it's a bit like the EE points system, no big deal!), I can still answer questions so that is all I need.

And you may call it whining, I don't think that that materially affects anything whatsoever. It is your prerogative (or is it just a determination to have the last word?), as it is mine to take the position that I have taken. But I do find it difficult to understand how you can say that I am whining, and in the same breath say no offense intended; from here it looks deliberately intended to offend.

[moa]

It isn't an issue, because I decline to be subjected to a policy that I must use American spellings and American date formats, which goes against things that I hold as important, when I am giving something freely that would take me time and effort to produce. OK, so I don't go up the rankings (it's a bit like the EE points system, no big deal!), I can still answer questions so that is all I need.

Are you serious? It's madness to expect you to use US spelling and date formats. A simple disclaimer or something at the beginning of a KB entry would be fine, surely. Something like "Beware! UK Author".

[Brandtrock]

Are you serious? It's madness to expect you to use US spelling and date formats. A simple disclaimer or something at the beginning of a KB entry would be fine, surely. Something like "Beware! UK Author".

I'm not sure it qualifies as madness. If I submitted something to Laurent Longre's forum, I would submit it in French and not be offended at all if something was tweaked, such as the date formats, to conform to the majority of users at that site. I realize that French is an entirely different language whereas Bob's point is between two "versions" of the same language, so perhaps my words ring hollow on this point, but that rarely stops me from expressing my opinion. :friends:

Regards,

[moa]

Oh, so somebody else would tweak it for Bob if he were to submit a KB entry without US date formats etc.?

I assumed he was told to fix things up himself or it wouldn't be put in the KB.

[Bob Phillips]

Oh, so somebody else would tweak it for Bob if he were to submit a KB entry without US date formats etc.?

I assumed he was told to fix things up himself or it wouldn't be put in the KB.

Personally, I don't think it should be necessary to change it at all, but it was the latter case of, I was told that I had to change the entries to the 'standard'. When this was passed back to me, the messenger even apologised saying that they did not agree, but that was the forum policy.

[moa]

not cool

[Brandtrock]

not cool

I would agree given that it was put to Bob to do it. I think it is completely reasonable for VBAX to have a standard for the KB's because:

The search mechanism, as currently coded, won't find color and colour on the same search.
Knowing that dates are in one format SHOULD keep the users of the code clear on implementing the code (knowing it is in US format, non US users know that they ALWAYS need to change).However, it seems equally reasonable to me that Bob would expect the approvers to do those tweaks to make it uniform if a KB is submitted with non standard bits in it.

The KB is a very useful feature here. I have yoinked bundles of code from there and appreciate the willingness of the coders who have shared. I have also learned much from Bob's contributions in the posts on this forum (and not all of that learning is code related necessarily). I think the KB would be much more robust if Bob were to submit entries that he deems useful.

I realize that the approvers are busy, are volunteers, and probably don't want to have to bother with changing spelling and date formats in submissions they are approving.

Would the staff at VBAX allow submission of KB's in the non standard format (Bob's for instance) if some hapless goof were to volunteer to standardize the format once all other approval issues are put to rest? If so, I would volunteer my sad yankee a** to do such a task.

[Zack Barresse]

Let me start by saying that the KB search functionality is not perfect. Our board coders have customized the KB and the KB search but were unable to deal with this issue. The VBAX staff has discussed this issue before but have not found a suitable solution.

Some of our most brilliant minds (names not mentioned, you know who you are) have brought up a suitable compromise which I believe is mutually beneficial to everyone. Where non-US people can still use "colour" if they want. What would happen is our VBAX Approvers would change any "colour" text to "colour/color". This would add the benefit of having the words and having the search capability for all walks/flavors (flavours ;) ).

With our current situation, I believe this compromise is both fair and advantageous. Please let me know what you think.

@Bob: I'm sorry about the comment, I'm not meaning to be rude at all. I saw it as frivolous but yet wasn't willing to pull my weight, and for that I owe you an apology.

[mdmackillop]

Let's all use "hue".:rotlaugh:

[Brandtrock]

Let me start by saying that the KB search functionality is not perfect. Our board coders have customized the KB and the KB search but were unable to deal with this issue. The VBAX staff has discussed this issue before but have not found a suitable solution.
I know Zack, the site has continued to grow and I was simply remarking that that is the situation, not impugning anyone for it. The coders do yoemen's work for the community and it is greatly appreciated by me. I hope I didn't offend anyone.


Some of our most brilliant minds (names not mentioned, you know who you are) have brought up a suitable compromise which I believe is mutually beneficial to everyone. Where non-US people can still use "colour" if they want. What would happen is our VBAX Approvers would change any "colour" text to "colour/color". This would add the benefit of having the words and having the search capability for all walks/flavors (flavours ;) ).

With our current situation, I believe this compromise is both fair and advantageous. Please let me know what you think.
I would agree with that. :friends:

Regards,

[Bob Phillips]

Let's all use "hue".:rotlaugh:

Can't do that, Hue is an aspect (property?) of colour, like saturation and brightness. Hue is a particular shade of colour.

[Bob Phillips]

Can I humbly suggest that we close this thread now, I think it is wandering off-topic, and I think that things are being said and being read out of context and there are mis-interpretions galore. I know that most are seeing it as an amusing diversion, but I would prefer to alleviate any possibility of offense (even Zack and I had a minor t?te ? t?te :)).

It has digressed to a discussion about the KB, and I want to make it clear that although I have chosen not to contribute to the KB because I couldn't be bothered to work through the process (tthe process as it was in my early days, Summer 2005), that is just a personal choice, I am not impugning the KB in any way whatsoever. Neither should it to be thought as an attack on VBAX, which is one of my two favourite web forums (JMT is the other if you are interested) - far better, far nicer crowd, than MrExcel, OzGrid, EE, etc.

Sorry for the sermon. I salute VBAX, and I hope to contribute for a long time.

[johnske]

Ya know - I rarely use spell-check in Excel, but I did a while ago and noted it didn't pick up two words I'd very deliberately misspelt as color and flavor. i.e. Excels' default language is US English.

I thought - damn, we really have to do something about this insidious invasion because lots of schools now use computers in the class-room and I understand why so many kids can no longer spell correctly, we really have to set the default language to UK English (http://xlvba.3.forumer.com/index.php?showtopic=308&hl=). :rofl:

[mvidas]

I thought the default language on this forum was VBA (Americanized due to Billy Gates)
Range("A1").Font.ColourIndex = 1
'Object doesn't support this property or method

This will definitely show my American idiocy (I don't claim to be good with words in any language), but why don't you brits spell it 'Terrourist'?

[johnske]

I have no problems with the code words Color or ColorIndex, just as I have no problems with Sh for "Sheet",... etc., they are the correct words for the VBA language. In fact that example just highlights the importance of correct spelling in any language.

But we're talking here about the English language - the written and spoken language, where, if you don't spell words correctly you will also get errors and miss out on a lot of the subtler nuances of the language - it's just sloppy programming... :devil2: